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Published Oct 14, 21
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Well, thank you quite. I want to give you all a break for a minute and rely on Mr. Swartz. You've been very patient, the three of you. I value that significantly. Typically, we would have had two panels, yet we didn't know just how the Senate would be running today, so in an initiative to ensure we survived all the treaties today, we did this as one panel.

Swartz, you mention in your testament and your declarations that the treaty with Bermuda likewise pierces bank privacy and also supplies a mechanism for us obtaining the information we require. There have actually been some mutual legal assistance treaties which contain provisions related directly to sharing bank records or other economic details.

Swartz. Thanks, Mr. Chairman. With respect to that certain problem, the board might be referring to the relatively new provision that appears, for example, in our E.U.-U.S. Mutual Legal Assistance Treaty, the identification of bank documents provision. That was a provision that was composed as well as embraced in the context of the E.U.

Under that stipulation, it's possible for the asking for event to seek info regarding whether an account exists in the asked for nation, or when it comes to the E.U., among the requested participant states. After that, the request, if there is an identification of an account, should be adhered to up through a basic mutual legal assistance treaty.

As well as when it come to Bermuda, our record of cooperation has been excellent. Our company believe that the record we have on the manufacturing of documents, consisting of financial institution documents, is such that we are confident that the arrangements consisted of in this mutual legal aid treaty, which do call for collaboration on the manufacturing of records, will certainly be enough to make sure that we acquire the documents we require for our economic examinations as well as various other investigations.

A few other MLATs additionally permit for immediate, non-written type demands to be made. It's my understanding that in Bermuda, it has to remain in written form. Any type of reason that arrangement was not included in this agreement? Mr. Swartz. Mr. Chairman, while it holds true that the Mutual Legal Assistance Treaty does require requests in written type, it was the judgment of the arbitrators that it was adequate that, in this instance, with regard to Bermuda, we would have the ability to get expeditious reactions to our requests as well as likewise provide such actions to Bermuda's demands, especially because we have a method currently established that will continue, our company believe, under the treaty of having the ability to communicate those requests via email or through fax.

Legislator Cardin. So was this, essentially, a choice made by U.S. arbitrators, that it was not required, knowing exactly how we can rapidly obtain faxes and also e-mails sent? Is that fair enough to state, or not? Mr. Johnson. Senator, if I can assist on that one? Legislator Cardin. Certain. Mr. Johnson.

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Bermuda withstood that due to the fact that they wanted to ensure that the demands were clear and also in an extra formal method. Yet in the arrangements, it also came to be clear that they accepted that such request can be made by fax or by email. So the real issue they were worried regarding was not locating a fast ways to make a request, but really simply taking oral demands off the table.

We're certain that we've obtained the ways in place that we can make urgent requests of them in a method that will certainly be effective. Mr. Swartz. Mr. Chairman, if I may add, in truth, while it is an advantage to be able to make oral demands, in method, it's extremely rare that we do so.

Legislator Cardin. Mr. Johnson, do have any type of comments on the bank records concern? Mr. Johnson.

The difference between having the ability to do an oral request or being able to utilize among these other extremely fast methods, we think, is not consequential. Senator Cardin. There have actually been some problems elevated concerning the adequacy of Bermuda law relative to forfeits of earnings as well as instrumentalities of criminal offenses.

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Swartz. Mr. Chairman, we are. Obviously, the growth of loss law is an important and progressive matter. We have actually seen a number of adjustments throughout the years, including below in the United States. But the Shared Lawful Help Treaty in Article 17 does obligate Bermuda to give assistance to the United States in process associating with loss of earnings and also agencies of crime, to the level allowed by the legislation of Bermuda.

We have actually had 2 instances of effective demands for restraint as well as loss of assets. Both circumstances were a success and we were able to get the funds. As a general matter, support is offered under the laws of Bermuda, and also I do believe that's crucial to stress and anxiety, with regard to cold, confiscating, as well as restraining properties, including for issues connecting to terrorism as well as terrorism financing.

Yet it should be kept in mind that loss assistance is not limited to what is allowed under Bermuda's residential law. With regard to an U.S. order, Bermuda can not surrender a details agency of nondrug offenses, because that power doesn't exist domestically. But again, that's restricted to instrumentalities in nondrug offense instances.

Legislator Cardin. In the Bermuda agreement, there's a provision that is not strange to us, where Bermuda can deny cooperation in funding situations.

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Are we impeded as a result of that or is there a way in which we are able to work together under this treaty, also in those cases? Mr. Chairman, we believe and we wish we still would be able to cooperate.

We have that experience with other nations that have put comparable interpretations on the mutual legal aid obligations, and also we've been able to function out plans in a number of instances that allow us to acquire evidence or talk about whether the evidence is significant sufficient to go forward with some kind of further actions being taken.

Mr. Johnson. Mr. Johnson. Yes, Legislator, if I could simply include in that, among the reasons this treaty took as lengthy it did to discuss and end is because it was necessary to us to make certain that there had not been an express constraint on help in funding situations in the treaty itself.

Swartz relevant to you. Which method we think that assists preserve the concept that is essential to us, that such participation needs to be available, irrespective of the type of case. As well as we believe this has likewise birthed out with some other nations, where despite comparable concerns concerning teamwork in capital cases, they have, for instance, been able to give assistance to the nonpenalty phase of a trial or another event examination.

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They do hold the right under this treaty to deny collaboration where the United States criminal justice system is seeking capital punishment? Legislator, they hold the right under the treaty to not provide assistance in instances that are contrary to public policy or their crucial interests, as well as they have actually told us that they interpret that to allow them, in fatality charge instances, to work out that.

I simply wanted to make it clear that they would certainly not be an infraction of the treaty. We understand their analysis, that if there was a case pending below that we needed their assistance, where, plainly, the district attorneys were looking for the death penalty, Bermuda can determine not to work together under this treaty.

If I could say, Mr. Chairman, significantly, the treaty would certainly need, since this would certainly be a denial under Short article 3 of the treaty, that first there had to be examinations with the United States, before that denial might go onward. As well as I assume that's a crucial facet of the negotiation that Mr.

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Rather than having an explicit provisionSpecific arrangement is one of a set of collection under problems assistance may support might after rejected, examination, and also other amongstVarious other that there must be consideration as to whether assistance can aid given, subject to such conditions as problems requested country asked for necessaryConsiders

And also I believe that would be handy for us to have that info in this committee. Mr. Swartz. Thank you. foreign tax credit. We 'd rejoice to provide that. Legislator Cardin. Ms. Mc, Carthy, you have the simplest work below, because this agreement was previously authorized by this committee. As I said in my opening, we accepted it also late in the 111th Congress for action.

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Have there been any type of substantial adjustments in our investment connection with Rwanda considering that last November when you gave statement on this treaty? Ms. Mc, Carthy. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. What we have seen considering that last November is a rise in United States financial investment in Rwanda, as well as I can give you a few examples.

Additionally, in February of this year, we have Hilton Hotels; it's is mosting likely to open a significant hotel in Kigali. And, likewise, Marriott Hotels is entering to assist in the nation's growing hospitality sector. I would certainly say that, given this pattern of boosted investment, that it is crucial that the securities be managed for them.

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investors. Legislator Cardin. I thank you for that (foreign tax credit). You also stated the reality that the United States is checking out various other reciprocal financial investment treaties in Africa. I think you pointed out another country. I believe we have 5 present bilateral financial investment treaties in Africa. Can you simply share with us various other nations that the United States has shown rate of interest in working out treaties? Ms.

Senator Cardin. Thanks. I have actually been told by the team that I need to ask the inquiry of whether the management still supports the Us senate approval of the Rwanda treaty, because it was held over from the last Congress. So, for the record? Ms. Mc, Carthy. We absolutely do. Legislator Cardin.



I assume that completes the questioning. I do appreciate your perseverance with the board and thank you really a lot for your testimony today.

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As established out listed below, we would like to supply upgraded information on reported UNITED STATE financial investment task in Rwanda. In 2009, the stock of UNITED STATE foreign straight investment in Rwanda was $1 million (according to the Bureau of Economic Evaluation).

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And also I believe that would be valuable for us to have that information in this board. Mr. Swartz. Thanks. We 'd rejoice to supply that. Legislator Cardin. Ms. Mc, Carthy, you have the easiest task right here, because this agreement was previously accepted by this board. As I claimed in my opening, we authorized it also late in the 111th Congress for action.

Have there been any considerable changes in our financial investment relationship with Rwanda given that last November when you gave testimony on this treaty? Ms. Mc, Carthy. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. What we have actually seen because last November is an increase in United States financial investment in Rwanda, and I can give you a few instances.

Additionally, in February of this year, we have Hilton Hotels; it's is mosting likely to open up a major resort in Kigali. As well as, likewise, Marriott Hotels is entering to assist in the country's growing friendliness sector. I would claim that, provided this pattern of boosted financial investment, that it is vital that the protections be afforded for them.

You additionally stated the reality that the United States is checking out other reciprocal investment treaties in Africa. I believe we have five existing reciprocal financial investment treaties in Africa. Can you just share with us various other countries that the United States has shown interest in negotiating treaties?

I think that completes the examining. We may have some extra concerns for the document. As you know, the document stays open for 24 hours, so you obtain a break. That's a rather quick turn-around time for this committee. I do appreciate your perseverance with the committee and also thank you really much for your testimony today.

Response. As laid out below, we would like to offer updated details on reported UNITED STATE investment activity in Rwanda. Various other than these updates, the answers offered by the Division's witness in the 111th Congress remain precise. In 2009, the supply of UNITED STATE foreign straight investment in Rwanda was $1 million (according to the Bureau of Economic Analysis).

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